[Bibi40k]

Hi there guys,
my BB's steering is ill and here is the description:

- first of all, the distance between brake disk and suspension's arms are not equal. right (pic1) is longer than left (pic2). there is also a wearing sign on the axle/shaft which say to me it is not on the right position. There is a CBR F3 here at work and also get this difference between right and left sides, though no wearing sign on the axle.
- in order to ride straight i saw that the handlebar is oriented to the right (pic3)... not that much you can see on the pic but visible enough.
- i also get some wobbles during deceleration at low speed, at higher speeds everything seems ok (rear wheel seems aligned but i red there is a problem with the ball bearings and they need to be replaced with tapered ones).
- if i lift it on the central jack and push the backend to let the front wheel suspended handlebars bents all the way to the left (there is a possibility that the wheel/tire is not well balanced).
- if i ride without hands on the bars the bike bents to left.
- tire pressure... 2.9 bar... checked.
- visual front rim checked and seems ok.



i red chapter 13 from the service manual and i couldn't see any adjusting procedure of steering stem and suspensions arms but the torque.
i'll replace these days both front and rear tires with a brand new Dunlop Sportsmart SportMax so there will be a closer check on the rim and also a static balancing.

i'm very concerned mostly on keeping bars to the right to ride straight. bike had an accident back on 2003 and the frame was replaced at Honda service because it appears on the papers.
Where should i start, any idea ?

 

[TigreST]

Some things to check and think about:

1) The axle spacers for the front wheel are not the same length. The correct spacer needs to be on the correct side to center the wheel between the forks.
2) If the spacers are correct then is the wheel mounted in the correct direction? The spokes of the front wheel should "bend into the direction of forward travel". Compare the spokes to those of the rear wheel, they should both "flow" in the same direction. It has happend before that the tire was mounted the wrong way on the wheel so that when the tire "arrow" is pointed in the correct direction the wheel is installed backward.
3) Another check of the correct mounting of the wheel is to check the clearance between the brake disc and the fork lower slider. This distance should be the same (or extremely close to the same) for both fork legs. Do you notice any strange wear patterns on the front face versus the rear face of each of the brake disc? Do the brake calipers drag on the disc on one side and not the other?
4) The "wooble on deceleration" can be a symptom of loose of bad steering stem bearings. How many miles are on the bike? Do you feel a "notch" in the steering when you swing the bars from full lock right to full lock left?
5)Handle bar alignment the upper and lower triple clamps that hold the fork tubes may be out of alignment. Check the FSM (factory service manual) regarding both fork tube removal and install, and also the front wheel install. Fellow site members also have done some different technigues for getting the front end/wheel aligned correctly do a search on the topic.

That's a short list, but all I've got for now.

Tony "steering North by North West..but heading due South" Bagley

 

[Bibi40k]

Thanks
1) this means they are correct otherwise i couldn't fit the disk between brake pads. the space between disks and forks are the same. how appeared that wear signs on the right spacer, stil a question mark here.
2) wheel is mounted in the right direction, even has a rotation arrow like tire's. spokes are the same like rear wheel.
3) brake disks feels and looks equally worn, also the brake pads.
4) there is no "notch" on the steering but the steering goes by itself to full left lock when wheel doesn't touch the ground.
5) like i said i was hopping to find some alignment adjustment in the FSM but all i could found was the torque value on chapter 13 pag 13-34 to 13-36

 

[Bibi40k]

i think spokes seems to be a little skewed for airflow control (who knows) and the boss/hub wheel is not in the middle of the wheel that's why it needs asymmetric spacers to keep it centered.
one more question solved

 

[Shewie]

I agree with Tony regarding loose stem bearings - they may need to be retorqued. The front tire may be worn slightly an these bikes are very sensitive to this. It may not be immediately visible, but if you're unsure of mileage an age it could warrant replacing.

 

[Bibi40k]

found this
http://www.cbrxx.com/suspension-tires-wheels-brakes/3379-forks-straight-3.html#post141235

 

[bladebird]

hi shewie thats very true about the tyre on the front i thought at first i was imagining it but it does feel bouncy in slow speed corners

 

[Bibi40k]

hi again
yesterday i have mounted the new tires so it's well balanced now. i saw the front rim bent so i gotta go fix it.

today i have unmounted forks and check them. they look ok but none of them were positioned at 39mm above the top bridge as the service manual says so i also fixed this.

riding test. bike still goes to left if i remove my hands from the bars, still wobble violently on deceleration if i remove my hands from the bars and steering still heads to the right in order to go straight.

Checked service manual again and this is what it say:
Front wheel wobbling
• Bent rim - need to fix this
• Wrom front wheel bearings - need to replace them after i fix the rim and still wobbles
• Faulty tire
• Unbalanced tire and wheel

Steers to one side or does not track straight
• ...
• Worn wheel bearing - probably this is the cause, i better order new ones
• ...

 

[TheDuck]

You don't by any chance have a top box fitted do you? This can cause wobbles on some Birds .... not all just some.

When you have had the wheel out have you bounced the forks hard to settle the spindle before tightening the pinch bolts? Not doing this causes all sorts of strange issues in the handling department.

 

[Bibi40k]

i do have a Givi e52 Maxia and 2 x Givi e41 on Givi WingRack2. Today i only had the top box. i'll test tomorrow without.
when i installed the wheel i first tighten the axle bolt to 59Nm then pinch bolts on the same side (right) then bounced the forks with applied brakes and at the end left side pinch bolts as in manual.

 

[TheDuck]

Yes have a try without the top box, as I said it doesn't fix all Birds and sometimes it is the top box combined with other issues....... but personally I don't think it is a coincidence that Honda produced (supplied) hard panniers but did not offer a top box for the Bird.

Glad to see you have followed the spindle seating routine :thumb:

 

[Bibi40k]

thanks but that's why are manuals for

ride test again without the top box guess what... ZERO WOBBLING at 50km/h i was very very happy. let's test it a bit faster, at 90km/h wobble says "i'm still here boy, chill". i'll remove the wheels and test the bearings.

the thing is (i think) that the rear end is shaking and generates the front wobble and the top box help this happens at lower speeds.

 

[Shewie]

...the thing is (i think) that the rear end is shaking and generates the front wobble and the top box help this happens at lower speeds.

Now there's an angle I never considered. Interesting thought.

 

[TheDuck]

The top box wobble only shows at low speeds and your 50km/hr is typical so I think you are getting there. Yes a problem at the rear can show itself at the front, I know I typed about that sort of vibration some months ago, I'm afraid it is a case of elimination but there are less possibilities at the rear

 

[Bibi40k]

after Easter i'll fix the front bent wheel, test it again and if is not ok next step is to replace front wheel's bearings, 3rd step steering bearings, 4th and 5th rear bearings and fork oil
sounds like a sitcom

 

[Bibi40k]

front rim fixed, wobbling still there at 70 km/h, even worse. next step wheel bearings, they seem a little worn at finger test

 

[CanadianBird]

front rim fixed, wobbling still there at 70 km/h, even worse. next step wheel bearings, they seem a little worn at finger test

Do front and rear bearing and don't forget the cush drive. I don't know about parts over there but maybe you can check out, www.partzilla.com

 

[Bibi40k]

thanks but what is the cush drive ?Honda Motorcycle Parts 2003 CBR1100XX A FRONT WHEEL Diagram

 

[CanadianBird]

thanks but what is the cush drive ?Honda Motorcycle Parts 2003 CBR1100XX A FRONT WHEEL Diagram

Honda Motorcycle Parts 2003 CBR1100XX A REAR WHEEL Diagram

Rear wheel.

 

[CanadianBird]

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