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Discussion Starter #1
I have spent a couple of evenings now going through a whole lot of posts regarding the FI light fix. These seem to date back to 2006 and beyond. What I have not been able to find is posts relating to the FI light coming on with many models beyond 2001.

My question is, has anyone successfully fixed this problem in a later model 'bird. I have a 2002 model which is showing the same symptoms. The FI light comes on about 30km into a ride and stays on. There appears to be no change in engine note, performance or anything. The loom fixes described ad nauseam all seem to pertain to 1999-2000 models. I found a vague reference suggesting later models still had an offending loom outlet but it was tucked further up out of the elements. So far I have not been able to find it on my bike.

If anyone has fixed this problem on a later model (other than an expensive ECU replacement) I'd love to hear your thoughts.....
 

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When your sitting on your bike the loom outlet is under the cowling on the left hand side, pull seat off then pull off the rear and side cowling (1 piece )

and you will find the honda plug, probably all taped up and tucked away, but its there,here in oz teef is the man to talk through your problem with

as hes been there done that, good luck
 

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I possibly have the same problem if you come up with fault code 25 as I expect you may. I have a 02 model also with 28k on the clock with this code. Mine started & would come on after about 30km or so but over the past few rides it's now on before I reach the end of the street. From what I've read if it is the fault code 25 related to the ecu its all over get another ecu and risk it all again it seems. Hard to believe that the ecu has this common problem and there isn't a repair, I sure wasn't expecting it. I'm considering if to go and risk it again or possibly run an aftermarket ecu.


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I had the same problem on my 00. I did replace the knock sensor, even though I knew it was most likely not the cause of the problem. During the process, I thoroughly cleaned the connections at the knock sensor, shield ground and the ECU connections. Paying special attention to the knock sensor shielded wire connection point. The problem did not immediately go away, however, after a week or so of riding the issue has never returned in over 1 year. This appears to be a very sensitive circuit so good connections are critical.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Well lads, I've finally had the chance to check the fault codes and I have 2, 8, 9, 15, 25....... Apparently Black Beauty is about to explode!!!! Haha, not really. I'm suspecting that the ECU fault codes have never been cleared in all the bike's existence. I've since cleared the memory and hopefully if this weather clears I'll get a chance to take her out and get the FI shenanigans a happening once more. Then I'll revisit the fault codes and let you know the result.

BTW, in the last 6 months I've spoken to 2 different "Honda" mechanics and neither of them have had any clue about this problem. Apparently in rural NSW, if the bike has less than 4 wheels or the tyres aren't nobbies they're all out of ideas..... Is this how it is everywhere??
 

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Well lads, I've finally had the chance to check the fault codes and I have 2, 8, 9, 15, 25....... Apparently Black Beauty is about to explode!!!! Haha, not really. I'm suspecting that the ECU fault codes have never been cleared in all the bike's existence. I've since cleared the memory and hopefully if this weather clears I'll get a chance to take her out and get the FI shenanigans a happening once more. Then I'll revisit the fault codes and let you know the result.

BTW, in the last 6 months I've spoken to 2 different "Honda" mechanics and neither of them have had any clue about this problem. Apparently in rural NSW, if the bike has less than 4 wheels or the tyres aren't nobbies they're all out of ideas..... Is this how it is everywhere??
Yes I wouldn't doubt you have had that response mate. I've also spoken with someone in OZ who has had a few birds last one did over 100k before being replaced due to a accident and never heard of this problem... From all I have read from guru's on here knowing much more than I, this fault code 25 seems to be more related to the ECU in Australian bikes possibly due to the hotter conditions.. the damn problem is doing my head in!
I'll possibly double check connections mentioned above again but they all looked fine and clean to me meaning probably the same ecu problem others have had.


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banksy20, given you had so many codes, I would be tending to make dead certain the ECU is strapped down tight. Over time the rubber strap degrades and either snaps or stretches and lets the ECU bounce around a bit. Start there and let us know what you find mate.

Ozblackbird, whilst a tend to agree with the heat related issue based on evidence I've seen, even here in Oz it still seems to be a minority of Birds that ever have the problem. If I was in purchase mode, it wouldn't put me off considering another one. Most folks still manage to go through life never seeing the problem.
 

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banksy20, given you had so many codes, I would be tending to make dead certain the ECU is strapped down tight. Over time the rubber strap degrades and either snaps or stretches and lets the ECU bounce around a bit. Start there and let us know what you find mate.

Ozblackbird, whilst a tend to agree with the heat related issue based on evidence I've seen, even here in Oz it still seems to be a minority of Birds that ever have the problem. If I was in purchase mode, it wouldn't put me off considering another one. Most folks still manage to go through life never seeing the problem.
Yes I do agree with that I really don't want to look for another bike.. I'm just so annoyed and dont know what to do.. i'm unsure if it might need the wiring fix or if it is the ecu as I assumed from what I've read. If its ECU do I risk another maybe it's not as common as I think it is or do I wire in something like a Haltech ECU I'm really stumped as what the best option might be to be truthfull but I surely want to keep it with it being fairly low km.


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Yes I do agree with that I really don't want to look for another bike.. I'm just so annoyed and dont know what to do.. i'm unsure if it might need the wiring fix or if it is the ecu as I assumed from what I've read. If its ECU do I risk another maybe it's not as common as I think it is or do I wire in something like a Haltech ECU I'm really stumped as what the best option might be to be truthfull but I surely want to keep it with it being fairly low km.


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Scratch that re Haltech doesn't seem like it's going to be as simple as I had hoped.


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Mate, just start by securing it down. Maybe sit it on a piece of rubber or something. Honestly they hate bouncing around. Start there, I would doubt your ECU is faulty.
 

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Mate, just start by securing it down. Maybe sit it on a piece of rubber or something. Honestly they hate bouncing around. Start there, I would doubt your ECU is faulty.
Yeh did that mate after you mentioned it. I have is wrapped in some 10mm thick foam and its even more secure now being thicker than the ecu alone so no chance its moving.. FI light is on even sooner now than it used to.
Looks like I have found a used later D52 ecu from an 06 model to replace the D51 unit from my 02 model. I was prepared to be a new unit if not too over priced and if I knew this problem might have been reviewed by Honda & the ecu manufacture but have no clue..
I'm hoping that this is the fix like all others that have gone down this same path as I do appreciate all the help you all have supplied and really don't want to have to do this again only done 1500 odd kms since purchasing it.

If anyone can confirm the 38770-MAT-D52 will interchange ok with my D51 that would be appreciated.

Have a good day guys.


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Yes it definitely can be done. Epoc a mod on here who lives near me has two birds. One is an '01 AU delivered with a D51 in it, the other is an '06 AU delivered with a D52 in it. He swapped his ECUs between his two bikes and they started and ran OK.

WHATEVER you do, make sure you get the keys with any ECU you buy. Both of those ECUs are definitely HISS equipped and will not run without the correct HISS chip in the key. Fortunately it is dead easy to swap the HISS chips into your existing keys, so you definitely don't have to change anything else.

However, I am not convinced you have a dead ECU. You have too many codes for that to be the normal issue we see with dead ECUs. My next step if it were my bike would be to get some contact cleaner spray and really do a number on the contact pins from the ECU to the wiring loom. I'm a bit suss when you said the light comes on even sooner now. That makes me think a wire or five in that area is not making a good connection.

If it is just code 25 there is little chance of it being anything but the ECU, but with that many codes I would like to see you exhaust every other option before splashing out for a replacement ECU and having the fault codes still come back.
 

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Thanks for all your help teef.
I only have a single error code of 25 mate this has been going on for about a month or so now.
I think your might have got confused with "banksy" above who has chimed in on this post with similar problems but had additional error codes.
I only have the single error 25 from the beginning but it just seems to bring the FI light on much sooner than it used to. To be honest I have checked battery terminals, all the plugs on the harness to the ECU and the KS ends all looked good the only thing I haven't done mate is the test block ie wiring loom fix. I've just been hesitant to go there with the bike being fairly low km and how good the terminals looked. I didn't really want to get into the harness too deep and also from what I read most error 25 codes have come back to the ecu.
Good to know the D52 will work ok as I did check with Honda and they say the ecu's don't supersede but doesn't suprise me it would still work.
I also questioned them about the problem with the ecu's as I was having concern buying a new one if it were to happen again and the word from Honda Japan was they don't know of any problem as such and only 4pce total of the D51 units have ever been sold to Australia.. little surprising maybe everyone have purchased used ones.
Know all about the keys so will be sure to get with at least 1 and hopefully I can program another as a spare from my current keys if it only comes with the one. Might try the contact cleaner as you say on the ECU & KS plugs just to be safe and see how we go although my feeling is I'm probably in the same boat as the rest of the guys with the dredad error 25 knock sensor fault.
Thanks again mate for all your input its valued very much.
Cheers


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As i said, it was familiar...

i had a D51 and my new one is a D52, all is well.

I'm sure Honda doesn't know the extent of the problem, mainly because BBirds owners resolve their 25 issue with used parts. It's an old bike, sells around ~4.000$, who is going to pay ~1.300$ on a new ECU? My bike had warranty and between KS, wire harness and ECU, it was around 2.200€ only in parts.
 

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As i said, it was familiar...

i had a D51 and my new one is a D52, all is well.

I'm sure Honda doesn't know the extent of the problem, mainly because BBirds owners resolve their 25 issue with used parts. It's an old bike, sells around ~4.000$, who is going to pay ~1.300$ on a new ECU? My bike had warranty and between KS, wire harness and ECU, it was around 2.200€ only in parts.
Very true ie New cost but when you consider you have no idea what you are buying used for $400-$600 and spend this to have the same thing happen again not idea really is it?
Hence I was hoping to get a reply from Honda Japan ststing they might have been aware and the part problem and it was revised as then $1100 for a new one may have been considered knowing that I won't have the same problem. I wasn't holding my breath thought expecting Honda would be owning up to a fault but thought being well out of warranty and having these parts in stock there might have been a chance of acknowledgment of this ecu to maybe sell what was is in stock but that wasn't the case. I won't be risking the same problem with a new one thus will buy a used one & take the risk like everyone else I guess.
Thanks for the help as usual guys this forum has been of great help to this newby XX owmer.
Regards Darron


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Very true ie New cost but when you consider you have no idea what you are buying used for $400-$600 and spend this to have the same thing happen again not idea really is it?
Hence I was hoping to get a reply from Honda Japan ststing they might have been aware and the part problem and it was revised as then $1100 for a new one may have been considered knowing that I won't have the same problem. I wasn't holding my breath thought expecting Honda would be owning up to a fault but thought being well out of warranty and having these parts in stock there might have been a chance of acknowledgment of this ecu to maybe sell what was is in stock but that wasn't the case. I won't be risking the same problem with a new one thus will buy a used one & take the risk like everyone else I guess.
Thanks for the help as usual guys this forum has been of great help to this newby XX owmer.
Regards Darron


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I think you'll be on the safe side here, as one said, if you install your ECU on another bike it will throw the 25 error as soon as you turn on the bike, so a used (faulty) ECU will have the same behaviour, as long as you can test it before you buy, or can return the ECU to the seller.
 

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I think you'll be on the safe side here, as one said, if you install your ECU on another bike it will throw the 25 error as soon as you turn on the bike, so a used (faulty) ECU will have the same behaviour, as long as you can test it before you buy, or can return the ECU to the seller.
Yes you are right I just wish I had another test bike or ecu to try but I don't so might have to take a gamble unfortunately..


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Got a new (used) ecu from IXXion and it cured my ecu problem. Old one was not secured by previous owner and it failed, now it works fine as I foam wrapped the new unit, so probably your's is bad also.
 
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