faijer

the blackbird is my first bike with dcbs . been reading allot about it but reading and reality arnt the same.
most people like it allot . but when i ride the bird sportive the back is sliding around when i shift back before a corner.
riding for 15 years on sportbikes and NEVER used my backbrake .
use the clutch more as a backbrake .
how do you bird riders think about the dcbs?
mine has to go , doesnt suit my riding style ...
tips on de-linking it ? or do i have to buy the kit

in the midle of the page
Jaws Motorcycles and Motorcycle parts supplys for the Blackbird

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heisti

i would never remove my dcbs!
fact.

maybe your rpm is a bit high in corners so the engine is breaking too much?
old tyres?
wrong tyres?

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PrimalDoubleXer

Plus, if you ever decide to take her out for what she's meant for (long touring at really fun speeds)...we're talking 1000+ mile days (if you can hang), and you are even going to come close to encountering rain/snow/ice/hail/etc. you will want the LBS!!!

Yes, it does take a bit of time to get used to if you've never experienced them before!

Yes, you will have to learn new braking techniques (kind of)!

Yes, once you get the hang of it, you (in theory) will be in a much safer position than a bike without LBS!

Leave them be and enjoy the learning curve. Although I've had my girl for eight years now, I can tell you that it didn't take that long to be able to hit a really tight corner, while downshifting AND braking. Hell, just the other day I had to downshift and break in a tighter than 90 degree turn due to a car stopped in the middle of the road...didn't break the back tire loose once.

It's amazing what years of practice with the same machine will do for both skill AND confidence!

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Partsguy

I'd rule out other reasons why the back end is sliding first.I took mine off for racing,never noticed it on the street,it's a very good system,not perfect in all situations,but very good.
Sounds like you're locking up the back by down shifting.Don't use the clutch to brake.
RR spring could be too stiff,tire old-losing grip,cold pavement,cold tires.

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heisti

example: rain and emergency brake:

you only hit the rear brake and even if the back tyre starts to slide your front still is braking in the safe zone.

one example of many why the combined anchor is a fine thing...

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faijer

riding normal it doesnt bother me at all.
its when i go to the local circuit on the industrie zone and ride it hard the back slides.
but yes , i shift back high in the revs using it as brake.
tires bridgestone bt 10 front and bt 21 rear on the subscribed pressure.
i only use back brake on dirt bikes .
delinking is better for my personal health
had the same post on belgium forums and everybody says dont do it.
but why do they sell the delinking kit then?
on the circuit nobody has dcbs

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heisti

because it´s additional weight

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shewie

Are you used to riding bikes equipped with a slipper clutch? I have never had the rear end go loose on me during downshifting unless I failed to match rpm/wheelspeed first.

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TheDuck

Horses for courses I believe......
I have 1 Bird that I use every day and I have left the LBS intact as the others have said it does have its uses especially when you have done big miles in a day and are getting lazy.
Bird 2 has nothing left of the std system and I'm more than happy with that and the total control that I have over front and rear.
IMHO the Bird and a sports bike are so far removed that braking has to be dependent on the machine, I will always use a tad of rear on a Bird if only to stop/lower the very large weight transfer to the front that happens if you front brake only.

elvetost

Well, you can alsways get the de-linking kit, try it out, and switch back to dcbs if you don't like it!
It's not a huge expense after all...

For purely circuit racing, you may indeed benefit from de linked brakes...

heisti

why not putting a shut-off cock inside for temporary de-linking?

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Partsguy

tires bridgestone bt 10 front and bt 21 rear on the subscribed pressure.
[/quote]

Get better tires for track use.That front must be ancient,bt10 haven't been made for years.

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CanadianBird

All the above advice is both very knowledgeable and imo accurate. If you want to use your Bird as a "sport tourer" de-link at your peril, imo. If you want to turn her into a track bike, go for it. If most owners don't delink it's for a reason. But hey, she's your bike, do as you please. I love the linked brake system and I have for 149,000 touring kms. Cheers

PrimalDoubleXer

His bike and his LIFE...the XX was never meant to become a "track bike"! :/

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faijer

i didnt buy the bird to go on the track , the lokal circuit on the industry zone is public road where we scoot around ....got other bikes to go on the circuit.i know its not a track bike , bought it for touring and every day use. we ride many kilometers a year (one month a year we go on bike holliday threw europe)and wanted some comfort.
my humble opinion is the dcbs is a very good system if you dont push the bike .
for touring and driving normal the system works very good , no problem at all . its just when you push the bike hard it gives me trouble.
but no rider has the same driving style and for me it doesnt work...
in the 15 years of driving without dcbs the back never stepped out (exept on circuitdays) .
ordered the delinking kit this morning , gonna fit it next weekend i hope

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heisti

maybe it´s cheaper for you if you choose other tyres?

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CanadianBird

What tires are you suggesting, Heisti?

Poundstretcher

sounds like rear lock up going down the gearbox too hard.

Partsguy

Sounds right for you then (delinking).
I'd still scrap that front tire.

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faijer

delinking kit ordered !
did 100 km today and the dcbs works really well touring around , not very noticable.
coming home did a few laps on the industry zone and today she hopped for me going into the bend shifting back.
now thinks she's a whasky whabbit !
gonna delink her and then ill grab her by the skin of her neck
tires ordered

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BackStreet

You seem like kind of a dope but I'll give you good advice anyway. There is nothing wrong with DCBS Or LBS.

Get some Dunlop Qualifier Sportmax Q2s, EBC HH pads, change the brake fluid and bleed the system. Brake the tires and pads in. Bleed the system again (I don't know where if comes from - perhaps tiny bubbles add up to big ones?).

Now go riding and see where you are. You will have better grip, better brakes, better things to do with your money and time.

Banshee

What you are getting sounds more like compression lockup than the LBS. The 'bird does have substantial engine braking ability & I have occasionally had it slip a bit when I have messed up a down change.

I would think new tyres & a bit more slip or rev matching might help. What were you riding before? A comparison in the behaviour of you last bike to the BB might help with what you are experiencing.

heisti

do you want me to start thread #503 about tyres?

here we go: D211gp without leaves

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Nobikeyet

Hi All,


I was reading this and I am a little confused.

You are saying that the back steps out when you let the clutch come up. this would mean the brake at this point has nothing to do with it?????? (at least not the stepping out part)
Or do you also have this problem by braking hard without using the clutch?

I was talking to mine brother who had his fair share of driving experience, and he use the clutch like you do when he was driving on the track just to gain more stopping power.
Bikes that had a Hydraulic clutch (in his opinion) are harder to control, they don’t give the feel as a cable one.
Cable clutch in his mind are better to handle in these situations?

I/We think you might be better off installing a good slipper clutch?

What do you think?


Kind regards

André

faijer

its my first Hydraulic cluch and now you mention it its treu.
cable ones gives you a better feel.
if i brake without shifting back the problem isnt there .
with my shifting down and the dcbs its too much for the backwheel.
slipperclutch is an option but i like to brake with the clutch.
the dcbs does what i want to do with the clucth and the combination is just to much for the back wheel even with a sporty tire .
the delinking kit is ordered and fitted saterday (if dhl makes it for the weekend!). weight saved , steel brakelines and use of just my front brake.
let u guys know how it works out.

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faijer

i shift down (when riding sporty) with a blip of the throtle.
last bikes were cbr 1000 and R1 of girlfriend . the bird is another bike with more engine bracking then sportbikes . its not a trackbike but its not normal (for my ridingstyle to never touch the backbrake) that under braking the back steps out or stutter over the road

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Banshee

I wouldn't have thought it would have that much more than the 1000's, (it only has an extra 137cc after all), but it would also depend on other factors. It could also be the different feel of the hydraulic clutch as it has a very short take up as the lever is almost all the way out in combination with the DCBS.

I do recall several comments by journos after release, that the DCBS was good on the road but not so good on the track unless you liked backing it in on all the corners.

EmmSqd

Based on your description, I'd have to kick my in to say what you are experiencing is compression lockup & nothing to do with the brakes. I suspect delinking will make no difference unless you are prepared to also adjust your revs & clutch usage when entering a corner.

I've ridden a few big bikes but never one with the engine braking capacity of the 1100XX. A lot of the sports bike riders I ride with keep telling me my brake light doesn't work - it does, but unless we are out & out scratching, I find that the engine brake is more than enough to get you around most corners. Generally, the only time I touch the levers when touring is when I want to actually stop.

My bike has over 60,000Km (including a number of track days) on it and I have just put in the 2nd set of brake pads - and the ones I took out still had some life left in them. The dual CBS is a good system & well worth keeping if your bike is an every day rider.

Oh and +1 on the tires. Good rubber will transform your Bird into a different bike.

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faijer

ok , after a delay from dhl i got the delinking kit .
spend a few hours in the garage and got rid of the dcbs system.
yesterday i had a ride of 120 km and here are the differences :
on the brakes the bird dives more on the nose. but you can compensate it with shifting back .
when riding sportive i can back the bird into a corner without losing traction on the back ! now i can ride the bike hard without any problems !
ok , the bird has more engine braking as the R1 but without the dcbs i can controle the bike better going into a corner shifting back !
for me this is way better ! for normal riding i would have kept the dcbs but now i can go fast without losing the back !
first time yesterday i scraped the peggs

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elvetost

Cool beans man.
Glad it worked well for you!