Height difference in risers, bars, etc... - Discuss Height difference in risers, bars, etc... on CBRXX, the ultimate on-line community for Honda motorcyclists. Read it in General CBR XX Discussion. (General Discussion of the Honda CBR 1100 XX Super Blackbird that does not fit into the other specific forums.)

kirkster70 · 10-13-2008, 12:32 PM

Hello all. New guy here.

I just bought a '99 that is all stock except for the 3/4" Genmar risers.

I've searched and read numerous threads on VFR bars, Helibars, Variobars, etc.

My question is this...What is the difference in rise and pull back between the VFR and stock bars? Would it be beneficial for me to replace the risers with the VFR bars? Could I put the VFR bars over the Genmar risers?

kirkster70 · 10-14-2008, 8:57 AM

Anybody?

I guess I'll just buy some VFR clip-ons and find out for myself.

CanadianBird · 10-14-2008, 8:59 AM

I think Heli bars dimensions are, 1" up, 1" out, 1" forward, or perhaps 1 1/2. I have Heli's. Cheers. Search??

TigreST · 10-14-2008, 9:51 AM

My 98xx sports the Heli bars that the PO had installed. I've got the stock bars in the spares box so do not know how one compares to the other in a real world sense. I know this, I like the way the Heli bars feel. Fellow Bird owner I ride with has seen both worlds in a on-road test and related to me the following:

While riding with the stock bars on his new to him low miles 99 XX: "I've got to get some Heli's for this or maybe at least try the VFR bars. The stock ones load my wrists and palms to much. My other bike is better with the Heli bars installed."

While riding with the newly installed VFR bars: "Well the fit and look is near to stock,..but I think I still like the Heli bars better. At some point I'll be ordering up a set again I think."

As in all things we each have our own opinion/s and the above is his opinion. I was also tempted to go with the factory VFR bars and remove my Heli's, but that idea has been dropped after the above comments from Mike.

I can't comment on the idea of stacking risers and bars but I guess it may work perhaps, as long as there is fairing clearance when the bars are at full lock left and right. The Heli's install with no other riser device still allows for ample fairing clearance, but they do move the bars higher so clearance is reduced by a margin. The slight wider span of the Heli's is nice to from a leverage point of view, which may lower the required input forces to the bars by degree. That said I've never riding the stock set up..but I imagine it may have lightened the feel somewhat.

The other issue with a stacked bar riser set up will be brake and clutch line length issues. A Heli bar set up will allow the stock lines to be used with a slight mod to the banjo fitting locators at the MC's (most remove a locator projection from the MC's so the brake/clutch line can be rotated to a better fit).

I'd recommend the Heli's if for no other reason then that is what I know best as a one stop shopping item.

Tony

kirkster70 · 10-14-2008, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanadianBird

I think Heli bars dimensions are, 1" up, 1" out, 1" forward, or perhaps 1 1/2. I have Heli's. Cheers. Search??

Thanks for the info. I've read searched handlebar threads for 3 days b4 becoming a member and couldn't find the difference in height between stock and VFR clip-ons.

That's why I was thinking that if the difference was only 3/4", I already have that in risers, so it wouldn't make sense to go through the trouble. But then I though maybe I could put VFRs or Helis over the Genmar risers and couldn't see where anyone had tried this yet.

kirkster70 · 10-14-2008, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TigreST

My 98xx sports the Heli bars that the PO had installed. I've got the stock bars in the spares box so do not know how one compares to the other in a real world sense. I know this, I like the way the Heli bars feel. Fellow Bird owner I ride with has seen both worlds in a on-road test and related to me the following:

While riding with the stock bars on his new to him low miles 99 XX: "I've got to get some Heli's for this or maybe at least try the VFR bars. The stock ones load my wrists and palms to much. My other bike is better with the Heli bars installed."

While riding with the newly installed VFR bars: "Well the fit and look is near to stock,..but I think I still like the Heli bars better. At some point I'll be ordering up a set again I think."

As in all things we each have our own opinion/s and the above is his opinion. I was also tempted to go with the factory VFR bars and remove my Heli's, but that idea has been dropped after the above comments from Mike.

I can't comment on the idea of stacking risers and bars but I guess it may work perhaps, as long as there is fairing clearance when the bars are at full lock left and right. The Heli's install with no other riser device still allows for ample fairing clearance, but they do move the bars higher so clearance is reduced by a margin. The slight wider span of the Heli's is nice to from a leverage point of view, which may lower the required input forces to the bars by degree. That said I've never riding the stock set up..but I imagine it may have lightened the feel somewhat.

The other issue with a stacked bar riser set up will be brake and clutch line length issues. A Heli bar set up will allow the stock lines to be used with a slight mod to the banjo fitting locators at the MC's (most remove a locator projection from the MC's so the brake/clutch line can be rotated to a better fit).

I'd recommend the Heli's if for no other reason then that is what I know best as a one stop shopping item.

Tony

I like the VFR bars for the stock look factor and possibly even a better build quality - I don't know. But the Helis also caught my eye as far as affordability is concerned. I don't see myself sinking $500 in a set of bars.

Strek · 10-14-2008, 7:15 PM

I have the VFR bars on mine. They look stock on the bike.

kirkster70 · 10-15-2008, 9:08 AM

Where is the best place to purchase extended clutch/brake lines?

I think I'm going to get some VFR clip-ons and put them over my 3/4" risers. I'm guessing that will give me close to a 2" rise. Hopefully it will clear the fairing.

TigreST · 10-15-2008, 12:34 PM

My aftermarket brake line of choice is HEL. They charge by the line, not by the length,..or at least they use to do it this way. Most of the more common bike brake line sets are in their database so they can custom build your line set to suit whatever your needs might be. The complete Super Blackbird set includes ten lines I believe, which replace the stock flexlines but retain all of the hard lines used in the LBS system. But you can/should be able to order a short kit to include only the lines you wish. I intend to order the complete package plus the clutch line and have them add an inch to the the clutch line and the front brake mastercylinder line. This will give me a complete braided stainless steel brake and clutch line system, with gold banjo fittings, and smoked (carbon look) line protective covering.

Gafler is one of the other name brands often used,..but I do not know that a custom length is possible unless you buy the parts and build the lines yourself.

Use HEL as a search word on site..there are a few related threads running related to them.

Tony

TigreST · 10-15-2008, 1:39 PM

A few thousand (more) words on the topic. If memory serves, the factory clip-ons as came stock to the xx, as well as the VFR clip-ons, are indexed to the top triple clamp pinch bolts area via a cast in nub with projects downward toward the top clamp pinch bolt void. This limits the clip-ons rotational travel around the top of the fork tube if ever one should come loose for whatever reason. The Heli bars are not indexed to the top triple in this fashion (but they do include double clamping bolts in their design). That may be good or bad, depending on your view point, but it does open up a range of adjustment for the pilot. The photo's below are an attempt to pass a little more real world info along. This is a 1998 model year machine. The pictures were shot with the bars to full right and full left lock. I'm attempting to show the clearance between bar and related control hardware and the fairing/windscreen area's. You'll also note the clearance between the bars control blocks and the fuel tank, which shows an approx. fingers width distance at the switch control blocks. You can also see that one of the hydralic lines banjo locator projections has been removed from the Mastercylinders to effect a slight change in the line locations to ease the fit of the bars. The dimension shown is a measurement from the flat surface of the top triple to the extreme top of the bar,..it is NOT a measurement to the bars centerline!

edit: I must also mention that these Heli Bars are, I believe, first generation units. The new production run will be somewhat different in appearance, but perform in like fashion.

HTH.

Tony

kirkster70 · 10-15-2008, 2:02 PM

Excellent information, Tony. Thank you very much!

tomus79 · 10-15-2008, 3:02 PM

For me vfr clips on made massive diffrence

Helvet · 10-16-2008, 6:51 AM

Check out this posting on th Dutch Blackbird-site about the difference in handlebars on a Blackbird. These are all my bars, but the posting was done by a friend.....
Blackbird Owners Club • Toon onderwerp - Differences between Handlebars - Original - VFR - Variobar

10-14-2008, 8:57 AM	#2
kirkster70 Join Date: Oct 12 2008 Location: Northern VA Age: 40 Posts: 55	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... Anybody? I guess I'll just buy some VFR clip-ons and find out for myself.

10-14-2008, 8:59 AM	#3
CanadianBird Join Date: Nov 25 2006 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 4,933	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... I think Heli bars dimensions are, 1" up, 1" out, 1" forward, or perhaps 1 1/2. I have Heli's. Cheers. Search??

10-14-2008, 9:51 AM	#4
TigreST Join Date: Jun 03 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 791	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... My 98xx sports the Heli bars that the PO had installed. I've got the stock bars in the spares box so do not know how one compares to the other in a real world sense. I know this, I like the way the Heli bars feel. Fellow Bird owner I ride with has seen both worlds in a on-road test and related to me the following: While riding with the stock bars on his new to him low miles 99 XX: "I've got to get some Heli's for this or maybe at least try the VFR bars. The stock ones load my wrists and palms to much. My other bike is better with the Heli bars installed." While riding with the newly installed VFR bars: "Well the fit and look is near to stock,..but I think I still like the Heli bars better. At some point I'll be ordering up a set again I think." As in all things we each have our own opinion/s and the above is his opinion. I was also tempted to go with the factory VFR bars and remove my Heli's, but that idea has been dropped after the above comments from Mike. I can't comment on the idea of stacking risers and bars but I guess it may work perhaps, as long as there is fairing clearance when the bars are at full lock left and right. The Heli's install with no other riser device still allows for ample fairing clearance, but they do move the bars higher so clearance is reduced by a margin. The slight wider span of the Heli's is nice to from a leverage point of view, which may lower the required input forces to the bars by degree. That said I've never riding the stock set up..but I imagine it may have lightened the feel somewhat. The other issue with a stacked bar riser set up will be brake and clutch line length issues. A Heli bar set up will allow the stock lines to be used with a slight mod to the banjo fitting locators at the MC's (most remove a locator projection from the MC's so the brake/clutch line can be rotated to a better fit). I'd recommend the Heli's if for no other reason then that is what I know best as a one stop shopping item. Tony __________________ "Stemmata quid faciunt."

10-14-2008, 7:15 PM	#7
Strek Moderator Join Date: Jun 25 2007 Location: Chicago, Illinois Posts: 5,072	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... I have the VFR bars on mine. They look stock on the bike.

10-15-2008, 9:08 AM	#8
kirkster70 Join Date: Oct 12 2008 Location: Northern VA Age: 40 Posts: 55	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... Where is the best place to purchase extended clutch/brake lines? I think I'm going to get some VFR clip-ons and put them over my 3/4" risers. I'm guessing that will give me close to a 2" rise. Hopefully it will clear the fairing.

10-15-2008, 12:34 PM	#9
TigreST Join Date: Jun 03 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 791	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... My aftermarket brake line of choice is HEL. They charge by the line, not by the length,..or at least they use to do it this way. Most of the more common bike brake line sets are in their database so they can custom build your line set to suit whatever your needs might be. The complete Super Blackbird set includes ten lines I believe, which replace the stock flexlines but retain all of the hard lines used in the LBS system. But you can/should be able to order a short kit to include only the lines you wish. I intend to order the complete package plus the clutch line and have them add an inch to the the clutch line and the front brake mastercylinder line. This will give me a complete braided stainless steel brake and clutch line system, with gold banjo fittings, and smoked (carbon look) line protective covering. Gafler is one of the other name brands often used,..but I do not know that a custom length is possible unless you buy the parts and build the lines yourself. Use HEL as a search word on site..there are a few related threads running related to them. Tony __________________ "Stemmata quid faciunt."

10-15-2008, 2:02 PM	#11
kirkster70 Join Date: Oct 12 2008 Location: Northern VA Age: 40 Posts: 55	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... Excellent information, Tony. Thank you very much!

10-15-2008, 3:02 PM	#12
tomus79 Join Date: Oct 14 2008 Location: Wilmslow Age: 30 Posts: 5	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... For me vfr clips on made massive diffrence Last edited by tomus79; 10-15-2008 at 3:18 PM.

10-16-2008, 6:51 AM	#13
Helvet Need 4 speed = Food 4 thought! Join Date: Oct 21 2006 Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands Age: 47 Posts: 429	Re: Height difference in risers, bars, etc... Check out this posting on th Dutch Blackbird-site about the difference in handlebars on a Blackbird. These are all my bars, but the posting was done by a friend..... Blackbird Owners Club • Toon onderwerp - Differences between Handlebars - Original - VFR - Variobar __________________ I'm not broke, I'm broken. I'm so poor I can't even pay attention. www.afsmotorparts.nl

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